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Snooth User: Psycheotix

I vacumed sealed my wine after 2 cups, how long will it keep till goes bad, 2? maybe 3 more days?

Posted by Psycheotix, Dec 4, 2008.

I usually drink my wine alone. This leaves me with lots of wine in the bottle since I usually drink 2 to 4 glasses. I vacuum seal my wine with a wine saver, but some wines I have noticed taste very different the next day and others well, I could say taste better? I usually do not drink wine after it has being opened and vacuumed sealed again for more than 2 days. Does anyone know how long I can keep on drinking from the same bottle after vacuum sealing it every time?

Replies

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Reply by Gregory Dal Piaz, Dec 4, 2008.

I can't say for sure but the seal on those wine pump gadget does not last very long. Yes there is a satisfying thwap of air rushing into the bottle when you remove the stopper but has it really helped the wine? Dubious?

For starters the seal is just not that strong and has sucked in a lot of oxygen even over the span of a few hours. During that time the reduced pressure in the bottle has allowed compounds to volatize out of the wine much more quickly than if the wine had just be let alone. To me the vacuvined wines frequently taste dull after a day or 2.

Here's what I do, it is an imperfect solution but works remarkably well. When I first open a bottle I pour half the wine into a clean 1/2 bottle and cork it, placing it in the fridge. that half bottle will remain well preserved for weeks that way. If I simply must have another glass out of the half bottle then I can either transfer the remains to a 187ml bottle or give the half bottle a spritz of nitrogen gas.

And if that is just to much trouble then buy the gas.

By covering your wine with these preserve gases you put an blanket of inert gas on top of the wine, much like the oil used in years gone by. This nuetral layer of gas really does help prevent the wine from oxydizing and putting the remainders in the fridge further helps to slow the reactions that degrade the wine.

So that's the long and short of it!

Hope this was helpful!

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Reply by oceank8, Dec 4, 2008.

I am sure Greg's way is MUCH better but I have been pretty happy with the vacuum sealers. From various snooth discussions I have learned to keep it in the fridge once open (yes, even the reds) because that slows the aging process. I used to take it out a long time before I wanted to drink it; however, thanks to Philip's suggestion, I now microwave it for about 5 seconds to take the chill off. It doesn't last more than about 3 days, but I can usually finish the bottle by then.

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Reply by Mark Angelillo, Dec 4, 2008.

Good tip on the 1/2 bottle, Greg. Like Ocean, I've also been pretty happy with my vacuum sealer but usually get back to the rest of the bottle within a day.

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Reply by Psycheotix, Dec 4, 2008.

Thank you Greg! I did find your post very helpful. ^_^

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Reply by Adam Levin, Dec 4, 2008.

Maybe this needs to be the next test after round 2 of the light test is completed - http://blog.snooth.com/2008/10/21/s...

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Reply by Philip James, Dec 4, 2008.

I use the vacuum sealers, but have 2 half bottles on hand for when there's around that much left.

My (light weight) chemistry goes a little like this:

> 1 half empty bottle has 275cc of air in it at 1 atmosphere
> Even if you attack your vacuum pumping like a crazed dervish you still have oxygen in there, lets say you are as strong as Mighty mouse you sill have around 0.25 atmospheres. That gives you the equivalent of 85cc of air
> If you fill a 1/2 bottle so there's only some space in the neck, you have around 5cc
> I'm a bit over zealous, so would probably use a vacuum seal even on my half bottles, giving me 1.25cc!

Caveat: in reality its not just the amount of air, but the surface area of the wine in contact with the air. So a 750ml bottle has a larger surface area and so degrades faster.

Placing a bottle on its side makes the exposure even worse, so avoid that.

And, refrigerate the wine - cold slows down reactions...

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Reply by Eric Guido, Dec 7, 2008.

Quick question for everyone that suggests putting this in the refrigerator.

I've read on more than one occasion that by changing a wines temp by more than 15 degrees in a short amount of time, greatly effects the wine and can make it experience something very much like bottle shock and make it dull in both flavor and smell. Is this not true?

As for what I do. I use glass bottles that hold about 1/3 of a bottle and have rubber stoppers. I pour off the bottle to fill this glass, seal it and keep it in my Eurocave. I've had bottles last like that for over a month without any noticeable problems but these are not value wines and everyday openers. I've found that the cheaper stuff usually degrades no matter what I do to store it.

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Reply by Gregory Dal Piaz, Dec 7, 2008.

Hey Eric,

I've never had a problem with bottle shock using this sort of storage method but then again I've only done it for relatively brief periods of time.

Sounds like you've got a great solution worked out using your Eurocave though!

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Reply by ChipDWood, Dec 8, 2008.

For my part; I think the style of the wine is what will really dictate how long it can be preserved using the Vacu-vin (or Houdini pump, etc.) type tools as much as anything else. If you're trying to preserve a lighter bodied Pinot Grigio or other similar, lighter bodied white- my experience has been that it has not lasted nearly as long after being "pumped" than say a full bodied Australian Shiraz or a big, young cab.

So, kinda depends on the wine you're trying to preserve. Best case scenarios from my experience have been (about) two extra days of drinkability for the lighter bodied whites, up to four extra days for bigger, more tanic reds.

The best use I have found for those types of tools have been to use them to decant bigger reds. Try it sometime with a young Bordeaux:

1) Pop the cork on a Thursday evening, pour yourself a glass.

2) Seal the bottle, do the pump thing, put the wine in a safe, dark place, far away from cats, children, or (God forbid) any aliens of any kind.

3) Pop the bottle back open the next day- thing will be perfectly decanted; or AT LEAST considerably softer, more rounded, and much more ready to go without the potential decanter shock occurring.

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Reply by John Andrews, Dec 8, 2008.

Or the best solution ... drink the whole bottle in one evening. :-)

Okay, I know, I am just being a smart-a**.

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Reply by gr, Dec 8, 2008.

I've just started playing with a Vacuvin, and I haven't used it for wine proper, but for wine-based spirits, especially rosso and dry vermouths, but also Lillets. Mark's approach on this is just to buy smaller bottles, but some of the truly tasty rosso vermouths (Cinzano--required for the Cyn Cin, for which, if I haven't already, I'll post a recipe in the appropriate place shortly--and Punt e Mes--actually roughly half vermouth and half amaro) are simply unobtanium in any size other than 750 mLs in the US.

In case you're dubious that liquor degrades, I have it on good authority that just a few hours of being open will drastically change (although not necessarily destroy) the taste of a vermouth, a state that's even more pronounced with the lousy stuff. (I recently pulled up a 1/3 bottle of S. Orsola rosso--that I'd purchased because it was all the PLCB had left a few months back--to make a regular Negroni and had to throw the drink and the rest of the bottle away because the vermouth was positively rancid, which was a shame, since it was a horrible waste of 1.5 oz of the wonderful Junípeiro that isn't exactly easy to come by in PA.) Most of your base alcohols are far too high proof for this to be a concern, but it's not just things with wine bases, it's also a variety of crèmes, which tend to have comparatively low alcohol content (my Crème de Violette, for example, is only 40 proof, so it lives in the fridge).

I've just managed to get a bottle Cinzano down low enough that it's got some serious surface area available, but so far (about a week) it's stayed pleasant (although altered) in its original 750 mL with a vacuvin top (opened only long enough to extrac 1.5 oz at a time) in the fridge. I think I'll be transferring it to a 375 mL bottle or two soon, though. The Violette has retained all of its flavor with its original cap plus refrigeration, and I just picked up a fresh bottle of Lillet blanc (it replaces one that has definitely turned overly saccharine). I'll report back later on how each goes.

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Reply by gregt, Dec 10, 2008.

For my two cents, I do what Greg does except that since I have one of those little vacuum sealers, I use that too.

Pour the bottle immediately into the half bottle. Vacuum seal. Put in fridge. I've kept wine for weeks that way. No idea whether the sealer works or not so I think I'm going to sacrifice a good bottle, dump it in two smaller ones, and then cork one and seal the other.

As far as cooling it too much - I don't think so. However, it is true that with the crappier wine, when you take it out and get it to room temp, you're better off doing it BEFORE you open the bottle because otherwise by the time it's drinkable in terms of temp, it's past drinkable in terms of flavor.

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Reply by gregt, Dec 10, 2008.

Oh yes.

Psycheotix - why are you drinking your wines alone? I'm willing to bet that you can get someone to share them. All you need to do is ask!

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Reply by gr, Dec 10, 2008.

Okay, so I've emptied the last ~600 mL of a bottle of Cinzano into carefully-washed 296 mL bottles (left one from ginger ale and one from tonic). I've sealed one with its original cap and one with a Vacuvin nubbin, stored each in the refrigerator, and I'm about to leave town for six days. When I'm back, I'll taste a splash of each separately and then make a Cyn Cin with each. Bearing in mind that this is after I'd already taken ~150 mL off the top of the bottle (which was Vacuvinned and refrigerated, but that opens some non-trivial surface area).

Here they are:


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